Watch What You Say – Guest Post

January 19, 2009 by The Constant Complainer

Here at The Constant Complainer, in addition to my own posts, readers can submit Guest Posts on topics they would like to complain about.  Leo Nevoli submitted the below-Guest Post.  His complaint is centered on certain parental decisions.  I always enjoy parenting and bad-parenting posts.  So I hope you too will enjoy, and without further adieu, here’s Leo…

I want to take this time to discuss a few events over the past few months that I witnessed, which left me thinking about me as a parent.  I try to be a good parent, and make sure that my kids don’t learn bad habits from me.  Prior to becoming a Dad for the first time, I admit that I had a bit of a fowl mouth and would let a few words slip out here and there.  I was not someone who used an explicit word every other word or sentence when I talked.  I would occasionally say a bad word normally when I was angry.  I would jokingly call our one cat Dipsh-t, and he would respond to it.  I stopped calling him that before the first Daughter came along.  With two children, I do not use language around them that I want them repeating.  My Wife told me I needed to control what I say around the kids, and I do, unfortunately my Wife does not.  For example, as we were watching the football games this past weekend, my Wife and I sat on our couch with our youngest Daughter.  Both girls were sick the past week with a cough, runny nose, Pink Eye, and were throwing up.  As we sat there, the youngest decided to throw up her dinner all over the couch.  The oldest Daughter, who is three years old, announces this event by saying “Oh god damn it, she threw up on the couch.”  As funny as it seems at first, I know my Wife uses “god damn it” very often.  I told her you correct the oldest and yell at her for using that language, I am going to clean up the couch.  Last thing I want is for her to repeat that around other kids or at Daycare.

Earlier that day as I was out shoveling the snow that fell overnight off my 22 steps and sidewalk, a 10 year old boy, was out trying to earn a few extra bucks by shoveling people’s walkway.  When he came to my house and seen me at the top of the steps he asked “Are you shoveling these steps and sidewalk?”  I told him I was.  His reply was “Oh f-ck off old man, you are taking my business from me!”  It’s my own steps that I am shoveling; I am not taking his business away from him.  As much as I wanted to tell the kid off, I did not because he was a kid and I was an adult.  I am sure that would have gone over really well with the neighbors.

On Christmas Day this past year, my Nephew who is four years old opened a gift from my Youngest Brother.  It was a western style gun toy.  You fire at a stand that had bottles and cans on it, and when the light of the gun, hit the “eye” of the bottle or can, the item will pop off the stand, as if it has just been shot.  His reaction to this was “Look I got a gun, I can go kill something.”  He is a four year old excited to go kill something.  I was stunned because a four year old understands what the word kill means.  I did not know how to react, because that is my nephew, and his Dad, my other Brother started yelling at him and dragged him in to another room.  His Dad does not own a gun, so I don’t know where he would have learned what kill means.

My Wife works at a Daycare.  This past November on Election Day, she had to handle an incident between the children in her class.  These children are 5 years old.  One girl was telling her classmates that she went to the voting booth with her Mom in the morning, and seen her Mom vote for Obama.  A boy classmate replied with “my Dad said you shouldn’t vote for Obama because…”  The boy made an offensive comment that my wife overheard.

I don’t know where that 10 year old learned that language.  It could be in school, it could be from a movie, it could be from his parents.  If he learned it from his parents, I can’t say I am surprised by it.  I am beginning to believe parents are not being responsible enough when they talk around their kids.  Is it not the Parent’s responsibility to make sure their child is not exposed to such language?  If the parents are using that language around the kids, do they not know that their kid will repeat what they hear?  I know Mr. Constant Complainer has posted topics about parents and children before, but there are certain things as a parent, one should know immediately, and that is children repeat what they see or hear.  If you don’t realize that before it happens, then your kids drop an F-bomb in public, you are going to be embarrassed by it and you will realize that it reflects your parenting skills.  It’s a shame to see kids these days learning the wrong things from their parents.  I’m Leo Nevoli, and that’s my ponderings.

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Comments

  1. Mike says:

    F#@$ you Leo!

    Just kidding. Yeah you’re right about kids using language they shouldn’t. I don’t think it’s a new problem though. Kids have always repeated what they’ve heard their parents say. The difference is, in the past they were punished severely if they got caught. Now everyone’s so afraid to discipline their kids that the kids don’t ever realize it’s wrong. I’ve been swearing my entire life, sometimes profusely, but I’m respectful not to do it in front of adults…

    Which is weird to say because I’m an adult myself, but still don’t quite see myself as one.

  2. The Constant Complainer says:

    Leo,

    You don’t need to take that from Mike. LOL. But I did laugh out loud when I read Mike’s comment.

    I’ve written several posts over the last few months with similar themes – the fact that kids are a product of their environment. They immitate, they are like parrots, they want to be like you – so listen up parents, give them a chance – show them the correct path.

    The CC…

  3. Zig says:

    Leo, F$%K YOU! How is that for being a bad role model for kids? I’m Mark Ziegler and that’s what I think…while you are at it, F#&K Mike too! I am an adult and I speak like this all the F^&KIN’ time!

  4. Otis says:

    An excellent post Leo. I went to a Browns/Steelers game a couple years ago in Cleveland and witnessed several children between 7 and 10 swearing at some of the Browns fans…and their parents (Steelers fans) were laughing it off. I just chalk it up to a bunch of stupid Steelers fans. I mean, in order to be a Steelers fan, you must be a flat out moron, right? I’m surprised they let Steelers fans even become parents. Maybe your kids are learning the garbage they’re spewing from Steelers fans…possible?

  5. Hal says:

    Let’s stay on task here, Otis. You don’t want to get into a Browns/Steelers debate, which you would surely lose. So yeah, the kids at the game were acting up. Leave it there and move on.

  6. Leo Nevoli says:

    Mike,
    My reaction to seeing your reply was pretty much how I felt when the 10 year old replied to me. Thanks for making me feel like Rodney Dangerfield. You do have a point, about lack of discipline. Parents may very well be afraid to smack a kid for language or wash their mouth out with soap because of fear of what the kid will say to someone at school, and what will happen to them if a law enforcement officer finds out. At least you know when you can say things, and you respect others by not swearing in front of them.

    As for Zig, clearly you have no respect for authority or others. If you speak like that all the time, do you work at a bar where that type of language is acceptable? If you don’t, where can you possible work where you can talk like that at a customer or fellow employee? Do you speak that way in front of your kids or anyone’s kids? If you do, in a few years if your kid comes home and you ask how their day was, and they reply go F-yourself Dad, are you going to reply back swearing at them and laugh at them like it is funny? Clearly, they would have learned it from you, and they are only doing what they see an adult does because they think it is OK to do it. What if your kid tells your Mom or Dad to go F- yourself Grandma/ Grandpa, after they are asked how they are doing? Are you going to be like “Yeah, my kid told you off Mom.”? It shows that your kid has no respect for your parents, and it reflects what you teach them.

    Sadly Otis, not everyone goes to a sporting event just to enjoy a sporting event. I have attended many events where the fans take their team winning or losing way too seriously. I attended a game once where one adult girl was turning around and screaming you suck to the Bengal fans a few rows back. As the game went on, when she did it the boy in front of her started to do it. The Dad tried to tell him not to say that, but everyone else laughed about it, and high-fived the kid. Here is a situation where a kid is learning wrong from the actions of others, and the Parent was trying to correct them. There are some hockey games I have attended where a fan of the other team will say something, then look and see I had my Daughter and quickly apologize for what they said. There was someone who knows and understands respect towards others; and being able to talk to them about the game and their team made the game more enjoyable for me.

  7. Otis says:

    CC,
    I could have said the disturbing behavior was because they are a bunch of stupid liberal baby boomers that have no respect, but I figured the Steelers story would hit home a little easier here in Cleveland.

  8. The Constant Complainer says:

    Otis, was your comment meant for Hal? I think you’re barking up the wrong tree with this discussion. LOL, I agree with Hal, but I am not about to engage in a Liberal/Conservative/Browns/Steelers discussion with you. Heck, I’m not touching that with a 10-foot pole. The CC…

  9. Otis says:

    Most humbled apologies, Mr. CC. That was certainly meant for Hal. I guess I pulled a ‘Zig’ and wasn’t really paying attention.

    Now that I think about, who does Hal think he is to make a suggestion regarding what I post and how I post it. Zig may be a supporter of communism, but I’m not. I’ll fight communism to the death. I’m betting Hal is yet another stupid liberal baby boomer. AND a Steelers fan. Am I right?

  10. Mike says:

    Otis, You certainly remind me of Don Quixote. Always fighting battles with imaginary enemies…like your war on Communism. You’re dead certain it exists here, but are foolishly mistaken. If you don’t know what I’m talking about, read the book by Cervantes. I’m sure you never read such stories in your private conservative nut-job schools.

  11. Tallelf says:

    I grew up in a rural area where profanity flew in the barn… not in the house. You could swear at a cow if it got out, but not at another person…even if they deserved it.

    There is defenitly a lack of respect in some area more than others. On a bright side, my neighbor has three WELL behaved boys who are that shining light that there are still some people who are not afraid to model proper behavior.

    Zig, I know that you can conduct yourself in a manner without swearing, so why are you portrying yourself in this post contrary to all your others?

  12. Otis says:

    Mike,
    I’m probably sounding like NCD here but communism is as much of a problem today as it was during FDR’s administration and throughout the 50’s and 60’s, probably even more so, since it is kind of cool for politicians to (and Presidents) to propose communist ideas…Hollywood still loves ’em too.

  13. Zig says:

    Talllelf, what is up witht his…”Zig, I know that you can conduct yourself in a manner without swearing, so why are you portrying yourself in this post contrary to all your others?”

    I have no idea what you are trying to write. Learn to use punctuation correctly, idiot! You may have grown up in a rural area, but didn’t they have schools? Boo Hoo! I don’t really care that you are an uneducated SOB and you try to use multi-sylabic words, but please use them well!

    My complaint is people who try to use words when they don’t understand the meaning of those words!

  14. Zig says:

    Otis, Zig doesn’t support COMUNISM! He support SOCIALISM! Socialism would work. It is known in literature as the perfect society. In Socialism all people would band together for the good of the group. Only, Socialism will never work in modern time. The human, especially American, psychological condition is ingrained with the thought that they have to have more and better “stuff” and more “stuff” than one’s neighbor. Until this childish condition stops, there will be no Socialism. Communism is an extreme example of Socialism!

  15. Zig says:

    Leo, you don’t know me. You don’t know anything. You do not know my situation. Please refrain from making attempts to paint me as the BAD guy. And never, ever think that you can give me “suggestions” or create hypothetical situations about the rearing of my children.

    My complaint is people who try to tell other parents how to raise their kids!

  16. Zig says:

    I respect those who give me respect and people who don’t jump out on a limb and make outrageously stupid comments!

  17. Otis says:

    I hate to let Zig move this one off the topic as well, but I just can’t let him float out the lies…especially in today’s political climate.

    Ask those living in Venezuala if socialism is the perfect society…or Mexico, or Eastern Europe. It may work in literature, but it doesn’t work in real life, because for socialism to work, the gov’t has to kill its citizens and steal from people. Socialism is slightly less evil than communism, and there is nothing moral about either.

  18. Leo Nevoli says:

    Zig,
    I am not painting you as a bad guy. You stated: “I am an adult and I speak like this all the F^&KIN’ time!” You wrote that yourself. You did not say anything about “except around kids.” If you added that you don’t swear around kids, then it shows you do have respect for other parents who try not to expose their kids to bad words. That statement alone, made me think that since you stated it yourself, you did not care who was around you when you talked, and you did not care what came out of your mouth. I grew up being told to respect your elders, and I still do. Your statement made me think that if I lived near you, I would be telling my kids to stay away from you.

  19. Otis says:

    Leo,

    I think you’re being too nice to Zig. If I lived near him, I’d move…Now that Obama is president, home values will go up by the end of the week, so I know I’ll make money.

  20. Tristan says:

    Otis, I think you meant to say, “Now that Obama is president, inflation will go up by the end of the week,” though if a person’s house were to inflate in the short term, it would be wise to sell it quickly before the rest of the economy follows.

    Zig, thanks to the First Amendment, you can say whatever you want. Based on what you do say, people will gain or lose respect for you accordingly. People are not afforded a high level of respect regardless of their actions and therefore should not expect unconditional tolerance.

  21. Hal says:

    Zig, no one is interested in your banter. This is a serious discussion board.

  22. Zig says:

    Tristan, where did you go to school? Probably the same hellhole place as Tallelf boy. The First Amendment to the United States Constitution is the part of the United States Bill of Rights that expressly prohibits the United States Congress from making laws “respecting an establishment of religion,” idiot. Based on your embarressing statement, on January 21 at 9:00 am, I will assume you expect my unconditional tolerance and acceptance of your lack of anything resembling knowledge! From your statement on inflation, I can see that you, like Hal & NCD, are a total moron and don’t understand how the world works.

    Hal, you are correct. This is a serious discussion board… WTF are you doing getting involved?

    Leo, don’t listen to these idiots. I agree with you. I think that the level of acceptance for profanity and other misdeeds by children has gone way down. My only point is that I can do what I want. When my son is born, due March 26, neither me or my wife will use profanity around him and will expect the same from anyone coming in to contact with him.

  23. Tristan says:

    Zig, I usually expect some resistance to many of the more controversial things I might say, but I have to say I never expected anyone to argue with me over the Bill of Rights… It seems you’ve quoted the Cliff’s Notes version of the First Amendment, here’s the full text courtesy of the National Archives:

    “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”

    There are some important additions there that you seem to have missed. I can provide a link if you’d like to read it sometime, it’s a pretty good document.

    With that little bit cleared up, maybe you should think more carefully about my knowledge of economics as well before encouraging others to disregard what I say (or anyone else, for that matter).

  24. NeoConDon says:

    Nice one Tristan. It’s always fun to slam Zig…

  25. Tallelf says:

    Somehow I feel that his desire to sling a personal attack will get the best of him. It usually does. Now sometimes he has a point, but other times it appears that he is just frustrated and wants to stir the pot.

    Grab a spoon and join him in his quest to raise a few eyebrows, and perhaps someone’s blood pressure.

    I believe Metallica had a song that he would like.. the one line went something like Free speech Free Speech Free &%*$(*&’n Speech

  26. Mike says:

    Tristan, I’ll still call out your “Knowlegde” of anything…especially when you think you’re a genius for quoting the Bill of Rights. Any moron could look up the exact text in the National Archives and copy/paste it in here to make themselves look smart. I see past that crap though Tristan. I believe Matt Damon said it best in “Good Will Hunting”; you paid thousands of dollars for that education, but you could have received the same thing for the price of a library card.

    Try reading to comprehend, not just reading for readings sake.

  27. Tristan says:

    Mike, I’m not sure what point you’re trying to make. The First Amendment is concerned with freedom of speech. There really cannot be an argument against that. I agree that a library card can be a valuable asset, so I’m also not sure what Matt Damon has on me at this point…

    I’m not going to argue for the sake of arguing, so if you want to refute anything that I say, please do.

    Zig, since it seems Mike is jumping to your defense, I should apologize if I offended you with my original statement or with my subsequent response to yours. Though I don’t enjoy being called a moron and an idiot, that doesn’t justify a condescending response.

    My original point was not meant to imply any negativity toward your choices in life, only that you have to expect resistance if others don’t approve, particularly in the case of moral objections. Personally, I don’t care if people use “foul” language. I don’t find any value in it for myself, but I’m satisfied knowing that others may use it as they wish, hence the First Amendment comment.

  28. Dee Dee says:

    I’ve been following the last two or three posts. Neat blog. Good content. Tristan, I think you’ve handled yourself well. You seem very educated. Zig doesn’t add anything to the discussions I’ve read. Mike, not sure what you’re deal is. Go back to Hardees.

  29. NeoConDon says:

    Yeah Mike, I have to agree with Tristan on this one…not sure what you were talking about with the moron Matt Damon quote…Tristan was simply explaining how wrong Zig was and quoted the most important set of basic rights designed to protect the citizens from gov’t tyranny, and you mocked it..???

    Perhaps instead of quoting the moron pinko commies from Hollywood in their moron movies filled with lies, you might actually try to read something that is non-fiction. Next thing you know, you’ll turn into Joe Pesci and start referring to our Founders as our “founding parents” and telling us how “spot-on” the “science” of The Day After Tomorrow was…even though nothing in that film is possible.

    I know how you liberals think and why you think it…How do you like them apples…???

  30. Judith says:

    Tristan has made some good points here. Of course that’s why Zig and Mike are attacking him. When you loose the debate, the insults go a flying. That’s why my comments on blogs are far and few.

  31. Zig says:

    Judith, you comments are few and far, because you have nothing to add, of any substance! And NCD can go fly a kite. That guy turns everything into a liberal failing. NCD, how does it feel to live in a free country where the Commander and Cheif does not lie to the citizens?

    The first amendment is primarily about freedom of religion. The founding fathers came to this country to get away from the church of England… so they could worship as they pleased. Hence, the “FIRST” AMENDMENT has to do with FREEDOM OF RELIGION!

    And who is this DEE DEE character? Let her stand and be recognized. She can’t just jump in, make comments and flee! What a bunch of hot steaming pile of DON/DUNG! Why does she jump in make attacks and then leave…never to be heard form again? That is a hot steaming pile of DON! If she comes back, I will give her a bit of my non-educated mind! At least she ended with an adult comment for Mike to go back to Hardees… How old is she, 12?

    See, Tallelf sees what I am doing… The rest of you are just misinformed participant in my fun! He even knows that it’s all suppose to be fun and…get NCD out of the peadophile chatrooms!.

    NCD, I am not saying that you are an idiot. I am not saying that you are a moron. I am saying that you are a “Misinformed participant” in my fun!

  32. NeoConDon says:

    Zig said…
    The first amendment is primarily about freedom of religion. The founding fathers came to this country to get away from the church of England… so they could worship as they pleased. Hence, the “FIRST” AMENDMENT has to do with FREEDOM OF RELIGION!
    ==================================================================

    You already admitted that you did not have a history class in college, so I can only assume you learned these lies from your public education “teachers”…I suggest you immediately sue the school district for lying, and you should demand the immediate resignation of your “teachers.”

  33. Judith says:

    Neo Con, you are right. Slamming Zig is fun. I like this board.

  34. Zig says:

    Judith, SLAM away all you want. Can I light a cigarrette when you finish? Be careful with whom you wish to associate on this board…NCD is a raging lunatic.

    NCD, one creates their own reality. That is why I am always right and you are always wrong!

  35. NeoConDon says:

    I hope you enjoy your reality Zig…it’s made up of lies and ignorance.

  36. Tristan says:

    I cannot prove that any one of you exist. I cannot even prove that I exist. Therefore, it’s certainly possible that the First Amendment doesn’t exist either. But until there is reason to consider such things, we might be better served by accepting both the reality of our perception and the implications that go with it…

  37. Zig says:

    NCD, haven’t you heard…Ignorance is bliss?

    NCD, you are the last person I would expect to be calling someone out about their ignorace… Wasn’t it you who said that the science and the scientific opinion of global warming is BUNK? People who live in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones!

    Alright, Tristan, you make a good point. I will gie you kudos! How do you know that I am even of this world? How do you know that the notion or “implication” of first amendment, (freedom of religion, or as you say speach) isn’t an allusion to keep the white sock and blue collar wearing, general populace of this country subserviant to the upper %5? Can I shout “Fire” in a crowded theater? Could it be that all laws are merely allusions! Are the laws of the land merely constructs of the rich and powerful to keep the status quo? What makes me interpret laws and societal customs as I do, while you may interpret them and their significance differently? Am I wrong? Does it fit your description of the first amendment to say that Government censors are monitoring the internet for wacko, home grown scemes? My perceptions are build on evidence I have personally witnessed during my 34 years on this earth. I don’t live my life based on “perceptions” or “implications,” do you?

  38. NeoConDon says:

    I’m not the only one who said the global warming theories were simply theories…There is a much larger group of scientists that are publicly against the theories than support them. With snowfall for the second time in recorded history hitting the UAE, how can anyone say that global warming is either happening, or caused by humans. It is absurd, and the perpetuation of it from a political ideology magnifies the web of lies that surround it. I’d like for someone to answer this question…What is the ideal temperature of the earth?

  39. Zig says:

    My complaint is people like NCD talking and breathing! The biggest cause of greenhouse destroying emissions is CO2. I want to make a suggestion that if NCD stops both talking and breathing, we could drastically reduce our problems related to CO2…and, therefore, the reduction of the greenhouse layer!

  40. NeoConDon says:

    zig..

    First, you’re stealing my joke…I already used that one on YOU…second, there’s no such thing as the greenhouse layer…Not sure what ‘science class’ you learned that in, but you should seriously consider suing the district. Third, CO2 is not a pollutant, although the global warming theory liars would like you to believe it…without CO2, plant life would not exist and we would not have any oxygen to breath.

    It’s unfortunate for the global warming theory “scientists” that they didn’t begin spreading the lies in the public schools while I was in school and college. There are still 3 generations of human kind that isn’t falling for this socialist plot to destroy capitalism, freedom, and liberty. I would suggest that if these liars want people to believe that global warming is real, perhaps they could show us one ounce of proof…and then agree to actually debate it in a public forum. Until then, theses morons have is Al Gore and The day after tomorrow to fall back on…both are foolish and filled with lies.

  41. Zig says:

    What about melting ice caps and raising sea levels? These are two signs of global warming. My complaint is people who don’t believe in something just because they can’t see it.

    NCD, calm down. I didn’t “steal” your joke. Show me proof that you once said that and show me your patent on the statement and then I will admit to stealing your joke. Until then, go pound salt! My complaint is people who think they invented everything…

    CO2 is a polutant when it comes into contact with Greenhouse, because it steals on of the elements and leaves just Carbon and Oxygen. Either one of those element attach to another element to keep heat from escaping from our atmosphere or Greenhouse uses one of those elements to keep heat in. I didn’t do very well in Chemistry in Highschool, but the science is there. You should do the research! Anyway, I don’t need to prove anything to you or for my friends at NASA. They are federal employees, are pretty smart scientists and can prove you wrong any day of the week! I am but a Customs paralegal assistant and I already prove you wrong on the Science of Global Warming every opportunity I get !

    So, NCD, you admit that CO2 is one of the causes of the greenhouse layer dissappearing… Interesting, because on one hand you said there was “no such thing” and on the other you said I stole your saying about “your talking,” (expelling CO2), being “The one of the biggest cause of greenhouse destroying emissions.” You are filled with contradictions! Learn to use the period, idiot.

  42. NeoConDon says:

    You are cracking me up. There is no such thing as the green house layer. The polar caps are growing, and sea levels are not rising. The 1930’s were warmer than today. But, let’s suppose that the global warming theories weren’t something created by fund-raising, anti-capitalist, united nation, dictator directed “scientists”….Let’s suppose that it was real. So what? It’s been warmer than it is now and it’s been colder than it is now. We can’t control it. How do we know what the “ideal” temperature of the earth is? We don’t.

    The most interesting part is that none of the “scientists” will publically debate the topic. That should be a red flag even to the weak minded like yourself. It’s time to let these lies rest. It isn’t happening, they refuse to show proof (beyond computer models), and refuse to debate it. IT IS A LIE…

    CO2 is not a pollutant…it is exhaled by oxygen breathing animals and is taking in by plant life and converted to oxygen.

    Oh yeah, the joke you stole from me is in a column that hasn’t been published yet. So you got me on that one. Good one. I don’t usually expect such clever thought from a total liberal moron.

  43. Tristan says:

    Zig, now you have a valid point. Domestic spying is a violation of our constitutional rights. However, it violates the Fourth Amendment, not the First. Also, shouting “fire!” in a crowded theater is illegal because it can and mostly likely will lead directly to the harm (not just hurt feelings) of other people, should it incite panic. So I think freedom of speech stands.

    Using your argument, I could say that my religion requires that I violently crusade against nonbelievers, but I would not be free to practice that religion without assault charges, thus freedom of religion wouldn’t really exist either.

    Then again, we might exist inside of a hologram:

    http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg20126911.300-our-world-may-be-a-giant-hologram.html

    Perception and implications are really all we have. I prefer to live my life based on what I see and what is implied by that…why wouldn’t I? Beats being subservient to that 5%.

  44. Mike says:

    Wow, I had thought this thread was dead and haven’t checked it in a little bit. Going back to the first amendment topic and my “Defense of Zig” on the matter, I was just trying to point out how Tristan corrected Zig’s loose interpretation of it by quoting the exact words. My point was that any idiot can quote the exact words, copy and paste makes it very easy. Next time Tristan, if you’re going to call someone out on a definition or meaning, put it into your own words instead of copying and pasting. It’ll have more meaning and people like me won’t call you out on fake knowledge.

    That’s not a defense for Zig, but rather a knock on Tristan’s extensive “Knowledge” of the copy and paste function.

    And Dee Dee,
    If you think Tristan is well-educated then you are part of the problem in America. All he does is spout off about religion and other non-relative arguments. He is the classic case bible thumper. That’s why I give him crap, even if he does have a decent point every now and then.

    Don,
    You are the most bias person I’ve ever met, and I’ve known some seriously bias people growing up in rural Grafton. You’re no better than the racists and anti-Semites I went to school with. Instead of hating other religions or races, you hate anyone who disagrees with your beliefs. What makes that so crazy? Well everyone should have some inkling of an idea that they themselves are not always right. You seriously lack that bit of common sense.

  45. NeoConDon says:

    You gotta love liberals…as soon as they realize they lost a debate, they call you a racist…or “no better than a racist and anti-Semite.” But you’re wrong Mike. I don’t hate anyone. I hate liberalism, progressivism, socialism, and communism. I don’t attack you, I attack your stupid beliefs and the liars who taught them to you. I may not always be right, but liberalism, progressivism, socialism, and communism are NEVER right.

  46. Mike says:

    Don, thanks for getting my quote right, because I did not call you a racist or anti-Semite. It was a comparison to show how much you do hate Liberals and their beliefs. You have very little tolerance for any idea that goes against what Republicans have spoon-fed you for years. There’s so much fear built into your view of the world that I’d be surprised if you weren’t afraid to leave your own home.

    I’m not liberal by the way. I’m a centrist, or middle of the road if you’d like. I have views on both sides, depending on the issue. It just seems that we haven’t talked about any issues we’ve agreed on yet. It’s not good to define yourself one way or another. You should be flexible and open to new ways of thinking.

  47. Tallelf says:

    And again to think…. Zing Slam Smash, this has started off with children swearing and being a product of their environment, and Zig and NCD get into a heated bantering about EVERYTHING ELSE.

    Have fun. Post wisely and enjoy the Constant Complainer

  48. NeoConDon says:

    First off, you’re a liberal.

    I can’t understand why it is so hard for you to understand the simplest things. I’m not a Republican, I’m a conservative. I don’t hate liberals, I hate liberalism.

    I am extremely flexible and open to new things…that’s what makes me a conservative. I think gov’t should be the last resort when it comes to solving problems…especially since they are usually the ones that cause problems. Liberals/communists always turn to gov’t first. They are the most closed minded people on the planet.

    It’s always funny how the libs (like you) say that conservatives have fear built into their view points…name them. Name one thing (except for my wife one week per month) that I’m afraid of. That would be entertaining to read.

  49. Tristan says:

    Mike…

    I thought the First Amendment was easy enough to understand. It is one sentence with three simple parts that ensure you are free to practice your religion, speak as you wish, and assemble peaceful protests. If I felt that needed interpretation I would have gladly offered my take on it.

    As for being a bible thumper, the idea is absurd. Never in my life have I used the Bible to beat someone into viewing things my way. That is against my idea of Christianity serves only to distance people. I’d also be interested in knowing where I have “spouted off” about unrelated things. Again, your only purpose here seems to be in meaningless arguments. Insult me as you wish. Others here seem to have an interest in my opinions at times. I’m not sure why that is threatening to you.

  50. Mike says:

    Tristan, the fact that this thread has been so extremely derailed is a clear cut example of how you spout off on unrelated tangents. Don’t worry too much, you’re not the only one. I try not to insult anyone unless they deserve it. I’m sorry if it bothers you, but you deserved it for trying to qualify yourself as intelligent with a copy and paste example. You’re not threatening to me in any way, I just find it hard to swallow most of what you say.

    BTW, meaningless arguments can be more entertaining than meaningful ones. I believe that I didn’t just throw out a meaningless argument to begin with, but was drawn into one after my initial comment.

    Don, I am not a liberal. I am not a conservative. If you refuse to accept that then it just proves my point on how close-minded you are. I don’t agree with “Gun control” and I don’t agree with Welfare. Those are two liberal views that I lean heavily right on, FYI. Conservatives are NOT open-minded. It’s in the definition of the word that says they are not open-minded. In no way whatsoever does conservative mean being flexible and open to new things. That could be the biggest lie I think you’ve ever told on this site, and that is a huge accomplishment considering the mass quantity of BS you encompass.

    If you really want an example of how fear controls your every action, all you need to do is see how you voted in the 2004 General Election. If you voted for Bush a second time, you clearly are overrun by fear. As an example, I’ll bet you believe that ever Muslim is a terrorist. Lie if you’d like, but I’ll bet it’s true.

    And one last thing…You do hate liberals. If you didn’t, you wouldn’t call public school teachers liars and idiots. Spin it any way you want, but you clearly hate everything liberal including the individuals.

  51. NeoConDon says:

    See Mike (from now on I’m going to call you ‘Libby’) this is a perfect example of how closed minded libs are. My wife is a teacher, and I don’t think she’s a liar or an idiot. My sister-in-law is a Muslim, but she’s not a terrorist. I think it’s great how you through out the fear comments, but can’t defend or define it…without making up your own definition. Perhaps you could give a few specific examples instead of behaving like a global warming theorist…’the earth is warming. But we can’t show you any proof, you can’t challenge it because 300 fellow scientists that are funded by the U.N. have reached a concensus, and we aren’t going to debate it publicly even though 10 times as many scientists disagree with us. The debate is over, and now we need to tax you.’ Is that what you mean by “open-minded?”

  52. Tristan says:

    Mike, I made a direct comment on a person’s choice to not “watch what you say”. I laid out the reasons why it could be important but also why no one can be expected to do so. Please cite an example of my single-handedly derailing anything.

    Also, please tell me how you would prefer I respond to being called a moron and idiot for believing that free speech is protected by the First Amendment. Presenting the text is the simple way to refute an obvious fallacy. Pointing out such a gross error is hardly self-promoting.

    To the contrary, your pointing out problems with my simple solution seems to be quite self-promoting, particularly when others begin to agree with me. You were “drawn into” a meaningless argument of your own ambition. You argue with Otis about communism, Don about political parties and global warming, and myself about absolutely nothing. As you now say, you find it entertaining to participate in meaningless arguments. At this point, I see no reason not to simply ignore your trolling in the future.

  53. Dee Dee says:

    Tristan, you don’t need to debate with Mike. Nor does anyone else. Anyone who reads your comments can see that you are well educated and have a valid opinion to share. From what I can see, Mike justs tries to draw people in and then break them down with insults. Probably some attack method he learned in the “how to debate if you don’t have all the facts” class he went to.

  54. Otis says:

    I couldn’t even get into this one without having to duct tape my head to prevent it from exploding. Mike is clearly having a bad day.

  55. Zig says:

    NCD, “Hate” is a pretty strong word. Come on now, you hate me because of my political ideaology? That shows a lack of patience and a lack of self control for you to say you “HATE” me… My new complaint is people who use the word HATE so frequently that it loses it’s real meaning, which is very strong.

    Dee Dee, what is up with the hate speach? You need to read awhile and learn who the good guys are on this blog before you jump in and call Mike and myself insult peddlers…and uneducated attackers! What opinion do you have? YOU just jump in and tear down others’ opinions. Come on..you can do better! My new complaint is people who blindly attack Mike and Mark… just to have an opinion on things!

    Tristan, you are just a pseudointellectual! I find it very difficult to follow anything you write. I can site multiple examples of you just questioning and talking about absolutely nothing at all! My new complaint os people who try to sound smarter than they are…

    Mike, you are the MAN! Keep the faith, buddy!

  56. NeoConDon says:

    I never said I hated you Ziggy. I hate liberalism, progressivism, socialism, and communism. You are simply a product of poor education.

  57. Tristan says:

    Zig, you can cite multiple examples of me talking about nothing at all and John McCain can fix social security (“that’s easy”). What do I do exactly to “sound smarter” than I am? I don’t use words that I don’t understand and I don’t change pronunciation to sound more sophisticated (i.e. “processees” instead of just saying “processes” like normal people)

    I wish Dan was still around…at least when he would fly off the handle he would have some sort of purpose in doing so.

  58. Mike says:

    Tristan, I have nothing against you or your wife Dee Dee. If you feel that you need her as a keyboard-backup to protect you from internet bullies then that’s cool. Try to ignore me if you’d like, but it would be awfully boring around here. I can’t imagine a world where I didn’t have you to debate with. I mean, you do throw out some seriously important ideas…borderline toilet reading material.

    Don, there you go again with the “Product of poor education” remarks. Don’t make me go back through your posts and “Tristan” some examples where you’ve called public education teachers liars and idiots. (Tristan = copy & paste). You’re so blind in your ignorance that you can’t even see the possibility that you’re wrong about all liberals being stupid. That’s like me saying all conservatives are stupid, when I know it isn’t true.

    Dee Dee,
    When you can have a thought process bigger than a paragraph, then come back at me with something. Your 20 word epic didn’t really say much and was lacking in the content department. Try harder next time please. The only difference between extraordinary and ordinary…is just that little extra.

  59. Mike says:

    And Don, in case you haven’t heard, the ice shelf along the Antarctic polar ice cap is melting. The crack along the shelf is getting wider every year and there isn’t much holding it on anymore. This is a fact.

    Ice doesn’t melt unless….it’s getting warmer. FACT

  60. NeoConDon says:

    Mike, You might have me there…there are a lot of stupid teachers. I know many of them. Are you a teacher? Just curious because you sound like them.

    The earth hasn’t been warming since the 30’s. There is more ice now in Antarctica than there was in the 70’s. With an average summer temp of 20 degrees, not much is going to be melting. We’ve been in a cooling pattern for the past several years….But I’m guessing you agree with rest of the Commie-Wood science crowd that says the cooling is because of the warming. It is global warming every spring when my 3 feet of snow melt? Or is it global warming every winter when we get snow? The earth has been warmer than it is now, and the human population was fine. It’s been colder than it is now and the human population has been fine. What’s the ideal temp for the earth anyway? We certainly can’t control it.

    The commies have been running with the climate change lie since the 1920’s, and every time we had only 10 years to fix it…Maybe they should at least try to debate it instead of hiding behind their computers designed by U.N. “scientists” with their fake pictures, fake scenarios, and fake graphs. I just can’t understand how much of a blind follower and closed minded person someone needs to be to believe the global warming morons.

    Here’s a little advice for you as we deal with our second communist president…when he does something and refuses to debate it, it’s because he’s lying.

  61. Mike says:

    HAHA Don. Even if everything you just stated was true, you’re showing just how hypocritical you are. You call me a blind follower. You claim that when Obama does something and refuses to debate it then he’s lying. Yet isn’t that precisely the same exact scenario we just went through with Bush? Weren’t you that stupid blind follower who listened to everything Bush and Cheney told you? Oh yeah sure, they’ve got WMD’s over there. Let’s bomb the crap out of them because Jr. needs to prove something to daddy. Let’s declare “Mission Accomplished” like an idiot. Let’s tell the people that the terror level threat for the day is orange…just to keep the sheeple in fear. If they fear their government, they won’t question things like the Patriot Act and illegal wire tapping.

    You conservatives have been living in the dark for the last eight freaking years. You’ve swallowed every piece of BS that idiot shoved down your throat…and the result…now you’re FULL OF IT!

    I don’t understand why it’s so hard for you to believe that some things are bad for the environment…much like some foods are bad for our bodies. How can you not believe that we’ve done damage to our ozone? How can you not believe that there are more cases today of skin cancer than ever before because of the holes in the ozone? Do you not believe that eating fatty foods can cause high cholesterol and result in a heart attack too? You’re blind ignorance to science is baffling.

    I believe in global warming. It makes perfect freaking sense. Do I believe there’s much we can do about it…NO. Do I believe it’s all man-made…NO. But it does exist. The polar ice caps ARE melting. I don’t care how or why, I just know they ARE. YOU CANNOT DENY THAT! Whether or not it’s our fault that they are melting is irrelevant. Whether or not the science behind it is a liberal lie is irrelevant. The Earth is warming. Deal with it.

  62. Mike says:

    Just another tidbit Don, if you keep allowing the government to take away your rights here and there, you soon won’t have any left.

  63. Tristan says:

    I haven’t been intrigued enough by the concept of climate change to do much research (Al Gore’s film seemed to have an underlying agenda other than science). It would be interesting to see factual, emotionless posts for and against the topic, though I’m not sure if that is realistic in this venue.

  64. Mike says:

    I didn’t even see Al Gore’s film. I agree it would be nice to see some factual posts on the topic, and I also agree that it probably won’t happen here. That’s the nature of the beast when people don’t agree on hardly anything.

  65. NeoConDon says:

    Libby,

    The earth has not been warming since the 1930’s. EVERYTHING is a lie for political reasons.

    Bush is a lib that listened far to often to the Democrats. If he had pursued conservative legislation, things would be much better. The problems with the economy has to do with every politician spending more than they were given. It has nothing to do with party affiliation.

    You’re way off on the lie thing. I can’t come up with one lie Bush told. Neither can you.

  66. Mike says:

    It’s like beating a dead horse Don, but how about “Mission Accomplished”? That was a lie. He lied about the WMD’s. Whether or not that was bad information is irrelevant. The buck stops with him. He told American that Iraq had WMD’s and guess what…they didn’t!

    You’re right, the Earth hasn’t been warming since the 1930’s. It’s been warming since the beginning of it’s existence probably. But it is warming. I never said I believed we caused it, but I do believe we can help a bit with pollution control. Even if we’re not helping the Earth, we’re helping make a healthier living standard for our own lives. Who wants to breathe in smog?

  67. NeoConDon says:

    Bush never said Mission Accomplished…the sign behind him read it. But looking at it further, perhaps you can explain what was so bad about the sign reading “Mission Accomplished” Did the ship and the crew he was addressing not accomplish their mission?

    Some old WMD’s were found in Iraq. We know Hussein used them in 1988. After we took control of Iraq, Quadafi turned all of his WMD’s over to the U.S. I agree that everything ends with the President, but calling it a lie is absurd. If that’s the case, Clinton is a bigger liar than we thought, so is Tony Blair, John Kerry, 33 other counties that sent troops to Iraq, and every member of congress that voted for the Iraq invasion. All of them are liars.

    The earth was warming just after the U.S. Revolution (after a cooling period). It has been warming and cooling periodocially over the course of history. Greenland used to be Green. Humans are not destroying the planet. The “green” movement is spreading the warming lie to try to destroy capitalism and liberty by forcing higher taxes and less economic growth. Obama is stupidly following, either because he’s a commie, or stupid. I’m betting he’s both.

  68. Tallelf says:

    Zig,

    “Tristan, you are just a pseudointellectual! I find it very difficult to follow anything you write. I can site multiple examples of you just questioning and talking about absolutely nothing at all! My new complaint os people who try to sound smarter than they are…

    This is not a new complaint. You say it about me all the time. Recycling insults, (Although they may fit, and usually do with me.. jk) is a sign that you may need to go out and experience the world a little more. I can add a little fuel to the fire with Global warming, as I burn wood for my primary heat source and release carbon dioxide.. oh wait. The Co2 that I emit from my burning of wood comes from the CO2 that they take in to perform photosynthesis. the co2 that you emit from burning your fossil fuels (heating oil, or “Natural” gas is CO that has been brought up from below and not necessarily been circulating for lifetimes.

    Warming and cooling cycles as NCD says are a normal process. Certainly we as humans have done our part to do some dammage, but what about the provisions that we have done through the Army Corp of Engineers to reduce soil erosion, and flood dammage that takes out many valuable trees, and other resources? Isn’t that a help, along with providing jobs (for contractors, and local merchants providing goods and services for the workers)

    And again to think.. the title of this complaint is “Watch what you say”. I think this group should probably start 2 ConstantComplainer guest posts

    1. I wish Zig would…..

    2. I wish that NCD and ZIG could just get along… agree to disagree, and stop brining every argument back to politics.

    By the way, on a non-related rant.. (Not that that ever happens here)

    Obama said yesterday that the weather in DC would not have cancelled schools in Chicago.. his daughter even said that they still would have been able to go outside for recess in this type of weather. Are we experiencing globalwarming? or is this just a different climate.. any takers?

  69. NeoConDon says:

    http://www.kusi.com/weather/colemanscorner/38574742.html

    Read this when you have time. It’s by the founder of The Weather Channel…former global warming believer, now realist and truth teller. It’s a history of the global warming lie and the birth of Al Gore.

  70. Zig says:

    Tallelf–Well, Genious, if everyone in America were buring logs in their “primary heat source,” it would be reason for concern… However, most of America doesn’t live like a assbackwards hermits. See, we have this new invention called the thermostat which allows us to set the temperature and the “furnace” magicaly pumps out the desired heat! Alas, you wouldn’t know about any of that… You grew up in small town America!

    As for my grammar and punctaution rant…The claim can be applied to multiple participants on this blog.

    My new compolaint is that CC allows dumb people to participate at all..especially people who don’t have a furnace!

    And I think NCD is the coolest and most opinionated and misinformed dumb guy I know!

  71. Zig says:

    Barak Obama won and is the first black man to be PRESIDENT! Deal with it! He’s also a DEMOCRAT!

  72. Otis says:

    He’s also a SOCIALIST Zig. Why do you care what color he is? What does that have to do with anything? I certainly am not cheering for the success of the socialist.

  73. Tallelf says:

    Zig you crack me up. Honestly, I would rather spend a few weekends a year getting exercise and spending quality time with family while preparing for the coming winter than spend thousands of dollars for oil, or natural gas that is just going to go up in “smoke”. I am sure that you have a strong founded family system that you are a great provider financially, but there is something rewarding about the fruits of labor that is personally satisfying.

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